Tuesday, December 13, 2005

Formation of South Asian Union

Praveen:
South Asian/SAARC Union 6/7/2005 10:04 AM
We all know, not so long ago the entire South Asian region was the Indian sub-continent or what some call United India! History has changed all that and we have borders separating each of the countries in the region. Yet, nothing can change the fact that the countries in the region have many similarities and share a common ancient civilization.

Now, I know some of you might call me a dreamer for raising this topic since we have differences like territorial disputes, terrorism, insurgency, naxalism etc.

But, why not? If Europe with a much larger area and more countries with differences and facing many setbacks(like the recent referendum) can still keep its focus on the ultimate goal of a united europe, why not this region?

Why can't we have soft borders, free trade area, relaxed visa regime, open societies, common financial system and currency, shared goals at international forums like UN? All this should co-exist with an individual's national pride vis-a-vis his/her country in the region.

It's only then we will be able to foster communal harmony and be economically prosperous. It's only then the world will respect us. The potential for this region is tremendous because the talent and manpower in the region is unmatched compared to the rest of the world. The world won't see the real South Asia/SAARC until we get our house in order.

Let us all help the South Asian/SAARC region in returning to its glorious past of becoming a world leader again in all walks of life!

I:
yeh praveen u have rightly pointed out 6/7/2005 9:34 PM
i agree with praveen in all his points. SAARC has to come forward with the economic and defence integration if it wants to get a respectable position in the world economy or politics. india, the largest member may not also enjoy much power going unilaterally. the present growth has made india very optimistic but it should not be forgotten that Germany, France, Britain, Japan etc are not anything if seen singally .... their power is in collaboration and unity among their group menbers.
Free trade among the SAARC contries is a most now and for that india must take lead giving many benefits for other smaller nations as it is going to be the largest benefitter in the long run. Other countries must see what they are gaining nad must not cry for th larger benefit that india is getting. Lets build a prosperious and developed SAUTH ASIAN UNION.

Vishal:
Hi praveen and friends

This is really a valid point that has been brought up. Our governments needs to work in this regard.

But I have a serious reservation. While it is necessary that India should help other SAARC counties, India should not be taken for granted. Things like terrorism, infiltration and the recent attacks on BSF soldiers by BDR should not be allowed to go unchecked. It is necessary that other nations see India as a friend and not as a dumb person who will take whatever is thrown at it. We need to promote our interests first and then that of the subcontinent. We can only think of a united sub-continent if countries like Pakistan and Bangladesh give up their hatred and age-old grudges. You need two hands to clap. SAARC can become G-8 only if all the member countries are untied and share a common interest. We want more than words.

I:
India must lead 6/11/2005 2:48 AM
you are very true vishal that india has lots of challenges from pakistan and bangaladesh which these need to check to make good union but it must not be forgotten that even in nepal, bhutan and sri lanka there is sufficient anti-indian sentiment in the public. this is because of the short-sighted policy of the indian government and over-involvement policy it is adopting.

for any country to evolve it must take "pig policy" ... and this is the only way to become a superpower. china never involves in the internal matter of any sovereign countries for which it gets good public support. the situation is recently fely in nepal. the kings move is condemned by india and is taken as internal matter by china. by condemning india might have made good impression in the eyes of the global democrats and the nepalese politicians but the public and the intellectual circle of nepal dont welcome the indian step.
THESE MATTERS DONT MATTER MUCH IF THE POLITICAL WILL OF THE SEVEN MEMBERS COME TOGETHER. IF FRANCE AND GERMANY, PORTUGAL AND BRITAIN, CAN COME TOGETHER THEN WHY NOT INDIA AND PAKISTAN.
with other countries other than pakistan there was never any problem. the only problem is the growing muslim extrimism in bangaladesh and hindu extremism in india. most of the problems here are not solved because the top order never wanted it to be solved.
The political will must come and india must lead.

Praveen:
I knew one of my Indian friends would mention these issues... anyway, other nations in the region must take into account India's concerns my friend pointed out here.

Please take back your comment vis-a-vis China after what they did in Tibet, the threats they give to Taiwan regularly, occupying north eastern areas of Kashmir from India and lastly, their hidden but long-term goal of de-stabilizing the north-eastern areas of India.

As for extremism, it should be condemned. Islamic extremism has affected just about every part of the region and the world and has been justified on the grounds that it is in the name of religion, which is totally baseless. Nothing can justify killing innocent civilians.

Hindu extremism in whatever form it exists in India is mainly against the so-called Jehadis and the Evangelist forces. They have been grossly misunderstood by the public and have been demonised by the pseudo-secular forces saying they are anti-minority, which I think is going a bit too far. However, they also need to reform in certain areas. Anyway, I don't think they will create a problem because organisations like RSS believe in Akhand Bharat... which is stretching a bit as unifying entire South Asia as one country is no longer possible, but a South Asian Union which is very close to this is possible, if people shed away old mindsets and address the problems and concerns of each country in the region.

I:
yes praveen u are right. u have rightly pointed out about the matters of extremism. in reality i also think that what u said is correct but one thing, is RSS really good for india and its cause is justified. i dont agree, we are hindus so we think from our side and it looks pretty good but any group that is not fair to all and is lead by some religious belief is not good for the country, they are the causes of social violence; RSS may be doing good by balancing the muslim extremism and the christian invasion but that maynot be justified fully.

there is a interesting experience i had while in college. one of my friend from Maharastra and i were going through the news once. there was a news that BBC is banned in nepal followed by the students protests regarding a panel discussion topic in BBC ....... should india and nepal be unified in the basis of cultural similarity.
he said to me, "if u look at the base of everything dont u think that nepal must be a part of india. more than the gorkha population in nepal, there are gorkhas in india and we share many things in common which makes sense of making a unified territory."
i said, " ok, then lets annex india to nepal. india will be a part of nepal and u will be then nepali."
he didnt like this statement and said, " ha ha what rubbish are u talking, india to come inside nepal??" ...

praveen if u look at joining the territories the result is same ... whether nepal annex with india or india annex with nepal, but our national sentiments dont allow that. country is made up of peoples and not of territories, and our goal must be development of societies not territories but this is hardly felt.

while there can be no loosing of sovereignity so building Akhand Bharat will not be digestable to anyone other than the indians. practical thoughts must come form everyone.

Praveen:
My friend, I don't support each and every thing RSS does. In my earlier post I had mentioned that there are some areas where they need to reform as well. I still maintain the view that they have been unfairly demonised by pseudo-secular parties, politicians and the media ever since Independence.

People forget the fact that they have done lots of social work especially in rural areas, they have done so much during natural disasters. For example, after the recent tsunami, they went and provided relief to everyone in Tamil Nadu, Kerala etc without even looking at whether a person is hindu, muslim, christian etc. But the evangelist forces were busy asking people to be converted to christianity in order to be provided relief. Where were the so-called Islamic extremists then? Parties like Congress allow the Muslim league to get away with burning of Indian flag in public when it is a punishable act by Indian Constitution.

About Akhand Bharat, I already mentioned in the first and previous post that it's stretching a bit as most countries in the region have now become separate nations for some time and so, re-unification into one indian nation is impossible... but, south asian union is possible and needed in the long run.

I:
i admit it.

now lets dicuss on what we can do to have a good unified economic block.

Praveen:
Yes, it's about time... we were shifting a bit from the topic of discussion.

Most important thing in a unified economic block is political will and stability in the region. The previously elected NDA govt in India first suggested this and I think the current govt and all future govts in India will have this agenda whenever annual SAARC conferences are held. So, in terms of the political will, ball is in all other nations' court.

I agree some of the least developed nations in the region will be fearing an onslaught of Indian products in the market... it's the same fear Pakistan has too. For all this, I ask all of 'em to follow the India-Sri Lanka example. Sri Lanka and India had strained relations not so long ago, but look at the situation now... bilateral trade is booming, many Indian companies are present there and employment scenario has improved. With mutual economic linkages, all the issues and concerns will be addressed with pragmatism by nations in the region because there will be something to lose for the nations involved.

Pakistan should stop the attitude of Kashmir first, trade later. They don't know it's hurting 'em in the long run. They can get cheaper goods from India... instead, they chose to pay the extra buck by getting it from western nations for keeping their so-called pride of not buying anything from an enemy as some of their officials point out.

I suggest all the nations in the region to take bolder steps and develop a vision for a more prosperous and stable South Asia. India has already agreed to take into account concerns of some of the least developed nations by giving them more time and a level playing field when entering into the free trade agreement. They also have to take into account India's concerns as pointed out earlier.

As for Nepal, now the King should stay to get rid of the Maoist insurgency. But, in the long run... democracy(open society) has to be there not only in Nepal but in all other countries in the region.

I:
Nepal has a problem 6/13/2005 5:37 AM
Along with having free trade with the SAARC countries Nepal must have free trade with China too else it wont have an advantage in increasing its foreign investments. being in the centre india will get most of it. for Nepal without free trade with China the economy will be only one sided and this wont be good in the long run.

India has made its economic movement multilateral by doing bilateral FTA's with Singapore, Thailand and talks are going to have with Australlia. india also has preferential agreements with many other countries including Iran, Afganistan, japan and others. In this context SAFTA will give a good advantage for the indian companies to grow and compete with MNCs and also india will attract more FDIs from foreign firms looking the whole SAARC markets.

India has been seen openly against bilateral FTA between nepal and china fearing the invasion of chinese goods in india. I think india has to allow the smaller neighbors to grow and not only support development in words and just interfare in their internal matters.

Praveen:
/14/2005 8:26 PM
You have a valid point there regarding multilateralism. India's cultural linkages with Nepal are much more than any other nation in the SAARC. I agree that it still doesn't justify the interference into internal matters. The present Indian foreign minister despite all his experience is making a lot of mistakes, with Nepal being the biggest of 'em all.

I think Chinese investment must be promoted by India and I think it will, as relations between India and China continue to improve. About bilateral trade like FTA and all, it is a different thing altogether. After the USA-China trade deficit, the entire world wants to see the end of the artificial pegging of yuan in order to stop the unfair upsurge of Chinese exports.

I suggest Nepal only does a PTA with China for the time being like India or else the situation will be worse than USA-China. India doing a PTA with China has benefitted and has a decent trade surplus with China thanks especially to the huge Chinese steel imports from India. So, I am all for Chinese investment in Nepal, but be a bit cautious while dealing with a bilateral trade agreement.

Ultimately though, if investment, whether Indian or Chinese, has to come into Nepal, the insurgency has to reduce and a stable government has to be present at the centre.

I:
i salute u pravin ... i was waiting for ur reply for long.

SAARC doesnot have just the Kashmir problem and the trade problems.

Regarding Bhutanese refugee problem also there are some misunderstandings. almost all the bhutanese refugees and the nepalese believe that the whole crises of ethnic cleansening in bhutan has been done with the indian help. most of the nepalese speaking people driven away from bhutan have gone to nepal via the indian soil as there is no direct land link between bhutan and nepal. I have also heard that the trucks were provided by the Assam and the Bengal govt for carrying the people. but when it comes to the solution india has always commented this issue as the bilateral issue inspite of its involvement time and again in making it complex. Everybody has clear view that india has to play the last ball to solve the problem but in order to please the bhutanese monarchy india has always been away. the largest democracy of the world has been helping Srilanka and Bhutan for ethnic cleasing. This is a black mark india is having and the issue cannot be neglected but it has to be rectified.

(to be contd.)

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